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AGM
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| Golden |
Posted on 05-08-2008 17:30
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Because it prevents someone playing 1&2 then fcuking off home or turning up at 10pm and playing 9&10 . .
The 7 player format would be a thing of the past so there is no need to work towards it . . Everyone will know at the start of the season that they are working with 5 so they adapt accordingly . .
. . so you still see people working their team around the fact that it's Old EPA rules?
No Armani No Punani! |
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| Billy |
Posted on 05-08-2008 17:40
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Quite The Regular
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Golden wrote:
I totally agree . . The CDPL has been notorious for not welcoming big changes and it's important to nurture the current format rather than changing it again after such a short period of time . .
In my view the league should not be dithering on this and if people dont like these changes then tough. We should be playing to the proper rules, including timing without going through the hurdles of AGMs etc to make them happen. I cant think of any other games/sports where rules are watered down to suit local leagues? You can talk about nurturing etc but you will always get those who are resistant to any sort of change, whenever you do it. |
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| Spud |
Posted on 05-08-2008 17:42
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Home From Home
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I think it's a question of integrity and sportsmanship.
In the Pawleyne last week, Paul Richards had to shoot off becasue he had work to get to.
He played both his frames early doors. No problems.
I'm thinking of the teams that have this scenario every week.
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| Golden |
Posted on 05-08-2008 17:46
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But for the few valid instances like the one above, you would get 5 people abusing it . .
. . it's fair enough with single frames as you put the person early and they go but with the opportunity of double frames is it not fair to say that if you have somewhere to be you either don't turn up or you don't expect to play two frames?
Edited by TheSaxtonator on 05-08-2008 17:49
No Armani No Punani! |
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| Lils |
Posted on 05-08-2008 17:50
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Spud wrote:
I think it's a question of integrity and sportsmanship.
In the Pawleyne last week, Paul Richards had to shoot off becasue he had work to get to.
He played both his frames early doors. No problems.
I'm thinking of the teams that have this scenario every week.
If someone has to go to work and can't hang around, they shouldn't be there.
But in a legitimate case, then why not simply put your player at 1, then again at ANY other number after 5 and ask the opposing team if they would mind picking a second player for that person so they can get their frames played and shoot off. Surely it won't happen all the time, so Secretaries with a bit of gamesmanship shouldn't mind.
And you should really be able to call upon a 6th player if you know someone is going to be unable to hang about in any one particular match. It's not like you'd only sign up 5 players.
Edited by Lils on 05-08-2008 17:51 |
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| Spud |
Posted on 05-08-2008 17:52
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I know waht you're saying.
But as the Away captain, you have the choice anyways.
For instance.
Eagles vs. Eden.
Power has decided that he's gonna play Sting and Truey against Kyle that evening.
Arrives at the Venue, and Kyle is playing frames 1&2.
So Power plays Sting and Truey 1&2.......
Same outcome.
If Kyle plays 1&2, 2&10, 5&6..... What difference does it really make? Other than he might go home early or turn up late?
(Just using Kyle as an example of course, no suggestion he's anything but a team player)
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| Lils |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:00
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Because the Pool League is losing teams hand over fist due to having less people in the pubs and premises shutting down for a start, so being able to play 2 players at 1 & 2, then 3 & 4, you're left with 3 players in one team. That's if the person who's playing at 9 & 10 turns up before 9.30. Not too good for the licencee who've paid X amount of money for their team to be involved. I know that's not why you enter a team, but surely the premises involved should get a bit back behind the bar for their money. I wouldn't imagine they do it out of the goodness of their hearts.
Team spirit: You should always have as many of the team there as you can, just for the whole craic of it all! It's a team sport; surely you should have as many of the team there as possible.
I thought the 2 sets of 5 frames was the proposal. This way it's simply 10 individual frames.
Edited by Lils on 05-08-2008 18:01 |
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| Shaggy |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:12
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I see know reason to restrict players playing whenever and wherever they want.
Playing 1 and 2 would not necessarily mean you would leave, it may be a justifyable ploy your captain may choose to ultimately win a match. I know for a fact that on a Tuesday night if I played 1 and 2 I would not leave until I was thrown out. If teams need to play players one and 9 to keep them their then they should be looking at their own teams agenda rather than making rules to prevent them doing so.
And Fieldsy, Halligan and Altes play 1,2,3&4, and your team nick a draw from them by hook or by crook. Who is in the box seat now?
Edited by Shaggy on 05-08-2008 18:15
House!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Golden |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:14
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Spud wrote:
I know waht you're saying.
But as the Away captain, you have the choice anyways.
For instance.
Eagles vs. Eden.
Power has decided that he's gonna play Sting and Truey against Kyle that evening.
Arrives at the Venue, and Kyle is playing frames 1&2.
So Power plays Sting and Truey 1&2.......
Same outcome.
If Kyle plays 1&2, 2&10, 5&6..... What difference does it really make? Other than he might go home early or turn up late?
(Just using Kyle as an example of course, no suggestion he's anything but a team player)
I agree but I don't think that's what's in question . . It's the point of someone being allowed to turn up and leave early or arrive late yet have the luxury of playing two frames . . Surely if they have outside constraints then they don't get to play two frames . .
As with any rule/format changes, they need to be in place for the majority and not Kyle who has to rush off because of his electronic tag! |
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| Lils |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:16
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But it's meant to be 2 sets of 5. You put your first 5 players down and don't have to write your second 5 in until the first set is completed as if you have additional players there on top of your minimum 5, you get the chance to play them or to see who deserves the extra 2 frames.
Granted, certain teams may have players that they will always have playing 2 frames whether they win or lose, but I just think the team sheet needs a little structure. You're giving teams the freedom of playing their players wherever in the second set, so why is there the need to have players playing in consecutive frames all the way down the card?
Some players turn up week in, week out and they're meant to make way on occasion for someone who wants to turn up at 10pm because they're playing football til 9.30pm but still get 2 frames? You commit to a Tuesday or you don't. There are always going to be times when someone can't get there til late or can't hang about. But I personally don't think this is the way to deal with them.
Edited by Lils on 05-08-2008 18:20 |
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| Spud |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:17
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Home From Home
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I agree with what you said Donna,
I am very much a fan of getting the atmosphere right first, and the pool will follow.
Pool or no pool, pub takings are down everywhere.
If the rigid 5 and 5 is preferred by the majority, so be it. It won't affect our team in any way.
I'm just thinking of the masses.
In Fieldseys scenario, yes, that would be very daunting, but you're still gonna have to play them four times, whether it be frames 1-4, or 1&2 5&6.
I don't mind the rigid system, but I can see it causing problems.
The main thing is to get more frames. Get the 10 frame format voted in. If and when that is voted in, have a seperate vote as to what format will be used.
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| Shaggy |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:18
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A person can turn up at one in the 7 man format and leave, a person can turn up at 9.30 and play 7. It seems to me that people are reducing flexibility, and I dont see how thats of any benefit to anyone.
The time flexibility was brought in for a valid reason I am sure. (Cant remember it though!)
And I thought Mark said he would have issues if it was being sold as a
2 * 5 format, and that it was a 10 frame format with a minimum of 5 players. (Though that could have easily been the other way round.)
Edited by Shaggy on 05-08-2008 18:21
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| Lils |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:27
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But it's NOT a rigid 5 and 5 Sean. You play your first 5 and then your second five could be made of 5 players who hadn't played a frame as yet, it could be the same 5 or it could be a mixture. If you had to play as per the result card as it is, then i'd say it was a rigid 5 & 5, but if someone needs to leave early you put someone else in for them or play them again at 6 and then they go, or ask the Secretary of the opposing team to let them play their second set frame early.
People voted this format in because they wanted more frames. More frames is going to take more time, yet now we're talking about people who don't HAVE more time?!!
And yes, a player could turn up at 1 in the old format, play and leave. But that's assuming they had 7 players. If they've STILL got 7 players, then thatplayer can still play at 1 and then leave, knowing there is someone else to play their frame. If people have to leave early or can't be there until late, they shouldn't necessarily be getting 2 frames. |
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| ThePower |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:29
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Spud wrote:
In Fieldseys scenario, yes, that would be very daunting, but you're still gonna have to play them four times, whether it be frames 1-4, or 1&2 5&6.
Who wants to see the top players having the freedom of playing back to back frames? Not me. I'd rather see them have an hour and half break before they are due back on the table again. From an opposition perspective who would want to see Altes/Halligan playing immediately after they have just broke and dished in under 30 seconds.... |
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| Dogger |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:29
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Spud wrote:
1. Kyle Win
2. Shaggy Win
3. Wiggy Win Break & Dish
4. Sean Lost
5. Steve Lost
6. Jake Win Break & Dish
7. Hughie Break & Dish
Tony then rewards his three players he feels deserve another frame, in this example with the three lads that B&D.
You couldn't use this as an example anyway as you have to pick the entire 2nd set after the 5th game, not 7 then pick the final 3 after frame 7? |
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| Spud |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:31
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Home From Home
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There would be no problem from me on that format.
None.
I'm thinking of the first week of the summer league, when we had lots of confusion on this very site about the playing order.
The general concensus was that it wasn't liked......
That's all.
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| Lils |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:32
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ThePower wrote:
Spud wrote:
In Fieldseys scenario, yes, that would be very daunting, but you're still gonna have to play them four times, whether it be frames 1-4, or 1&2 5&6.
Who wants to see the top players having the freedom of playing back to back frames? Not me. I'd rather see them have an hour and half break before they are due back on the table again. From an opposition perspective who would want to see Altes/Halligan playing immediately after they have just broke and dished in under 30 seconds....
Exactly Alex. I make you right.
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| Shaggy |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:33
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Which is what I said some months ago. You are actually restricting the flexibility of teams selection options for those that turn up with more than 5 players. Hows that fair?
Edited by Shaggy on 05-08-2008 18:35
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| Lils |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:34
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Dogger wrote:
Spud wrote:
1. Kyle Win
2. Shaggy Win
3. Wiggy Win Break & Dish
4. Sean Lost
5. Steve Lost
6. Jake Win Break & Dish
7. Hughie Break & Dish
Tony then rewards his three players he feels deserve another frame, in this example with the three lads that B&D.
You couldn't use this as an example anyway as you have to pick the entire 2nd set after the 5th game, not 7 then pick the final 3 after frame 7?
Well spotted Dogger. Shame you can't see the right shot to play on the table as well. . .
Surely with a 10 frame format, you'd have to write your entire 10 players down in one go? Not as and when you feel like it? This is the whole point about a LITTLE bit of structure being needed or you'll get stuff like this being contested. |
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| Lils |
Posted on 05-08-2008 18:36
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Shaggy wrote:
Which is what I said some months ago. You are actually be restricting the flexibility of teams selection options that turn up with more than 5 players. Hows that fair?
How so? Right now with the seven frame format that the League is due to return to, you could only play 7 of your players full stop, even though many teams had more than this turning up.
At least this way you have the flexability of playing between 5 and 10! How is that UNfair? |
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