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Division 3 Waddon Wizards vs Beechtree Meeting
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| jonesy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 15:19
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Just Popping In
Posts: 9
Joined: 03.09.09
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A meeting is to be held on Friday 18th September @ 7pm at the Penge Conservative Club to discuss the reasons behind the unfortunate walk over win that was given to the Waddon Wizards after the miss communication of a postponed match. All team representatives are welcome to the meeting but I have been told by Bob that only secretary's will be allowed to be involved in discussion. (please correct me if I am wrong).
I know from speaking to many of you over the past few weeks that we all have our own very strong opinions on this matter and I urge you to be at this meeting to make those opions count. |
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| Andy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 15:57
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Getting The Hang Of It
Posts: 41
Joined: 03.06.09
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Sorry I can't make it as I'll be in Cornwall by then. My view is that (as per the rules) postponments shouldn't really be allowed, especially as you only need 3 players to make a legal team. However, if one is agreed or is thought to have been agreed then any change has to be communicated and confirmed by both parties - e.g if you don't get through you keep trying until you do actually speak to the opposition secretary or you leave a message at the pub/club the team plays out of and get someone to call you back. My opinion on the particular game in question is that the fairest thing would be to play it.
Hope the meeting is not too hostile!  |
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| jonesy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 16:54
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Just Popping In
Posts: 9
Joined: 03.09.09
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Cheers Andy sorry you can't make it, but completely agree with your point. The 3 main points I will be raising are:
1. Why was there no verbal communication between the 2 secretary's.
2. Why has a team been able to postpone 3 matches in 1 season.
3. How does a member of the commitee and team secretary, supposedly promoting sportsmanship behaviour, warrant phoning another secretary in work then proceed to shout and swear at them down the phone.
Your thoughts please |
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| longshanks |
Posted on 17-09-2009 18:23
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Must Get Out More
Posts: 709
Joined: 07.10.07
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I think postponements should only be allowed in exceptional circumstances and only if both secretaries can agree a mutually convenient date.
This match should be replayed because there was no proper communication to the Beech Tree that the Waddon were able to field a team. |
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| Blockapocket |
Posted on 17-09-2009 18:35
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Home From Home
Posts: 374
Joined: 09.09.09
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The facts
A postponment was asked for but denied by the beechtree.
So the game should have taken place as per league fixture.
If the away team fails to show THATS A WALKOVER.
How long should a home team wait one hour,one week
or in this case amonth before a result is reached |
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| Dogger |
Posted on 17-09-2009 18:53
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Must Get Out More
Posts: 805
Joined: 02.10.07
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hold on, i thought the beechtree AGREED to the postponment, thats why they didnt go along to the match. then apparantly one phone call was made from the waddon to the beechtree to confirm that they COULD get a team out, no answer from the beechtree after one attempt, 10-0 walkover claimed.
does anyone else agree that this is basically what has happened?
for the record, when i stated on here regarding our postponed game with the waddon that if we didnt hear anything from them by the following tuesday (2 weeks after the original fixture) we would claim the 10-0 win against them, the next day our secretary had 3/4 missed calls and voicemail from the waddon asking for a date to rearrange the match. wonder why they suddenly made a few calls to our secretary not just the one attempt... |
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| JamieMc |
Posted on 17-09-2009 18:56
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Quite The Regular
Posts: 157
Joined: 05.10.07
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also the facts (allegedly) are that confusion was caused by notifying the beechtree that you wouldnt be able to field a team as (2!!) of your team were on holiday; one week after you couldnt get a driver to travel to biggin hill. Failing to then confirm to the beechtree that you would be in attendance resulted in them failing to attend themselves. without the notification they WOULD have turned up! So on that basis the match should be replayed, as after all this is a gentlemens league - the same one which allowed to postpone the match a biggin hill. whislt i personally have no problems with the waddon and have enjoyed many a match with you guys over the years....a tad more common sense would have prevented the entire division becoming beechtree fans  |
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| JugglingSpence |
Posted on 17-09-2009 19:05
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Home From Home
Posts: 271
Joined: 05.10.07
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I really can't see ANY reasons for postponing a match at all.
Tuesday = pool. Who doesn't know that?
If you can't play your match then you lose out on a chance of taking any points from it. You only need 3 players to play so if you can't fulfill that comment can anyone really argue that their team deserves to keep their spot in the league? It shows a huge lack of commitment.
And to argue that they asked for a postponement but didn't get it is one of the most ridiculous things I've heard in ages.
Once the Wizzards said that they couldn't make it did they expect the Beechtree to turn up to the Waddon and have a knock around? Do you think that there might be a slight chance that they were intending to spend the night at home rather than going to a canceled match?
As happy as a single man living above a chip shop |
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| longshanks |
Posted on 17-09-2009 19:09
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Must Get Out More
Posts: 709
Joined: 07.10.07
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My understanding is that the Beech Tree said that they could only play on Tuesdays, so the Waddon said that it would be postponed till the end of the season. It's quite clear that the Beech Tree did not know that the Waddon were able to fulfill the original fixture, otherwise they would have turned up. It's miscommunication so the only fair solution is a replay. |
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| Shaggy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 19:24
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Must Get Out More
Posts: 888
Joined: 02.10.07
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I dont see that the Beechtrees request to play on a different Tuesday was inappropriate. We (The Eagles) played two games at two different veunues on one night last year. Start one early and the other one late, is not an impossible request. Just needs a bit of communication thats all.
Ultimately you can spout allegations and counter allegations, and use the constiution until you are blue in the face but the real question should be.
Why on earth would anyone actually want to claim a game?
We are in the league to play pool last time I looked.
Edited by Shaggy on 17-09-2009 19:25
House!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| jonesy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 19:29
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Just Popping In
Posts: 9
Joined: 03.09.09
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Yes you are correct. The Beechtree refused to postpone to any other day than a Tuesday as we could only field a team of 3 possibly 4 players on any other day of the week, this was relayed to Martin Pantony the week before the match who then told me he was going to re-arrange it for the end of the season, which we were awaiting confirmation of but never received.
I'm glad someone else agrees with me that a small journey over to Waddon (about 8miles) for a game which to our knowledge isn't even meant to be on wasn't going to happen. As it was we had 7 players available that night and 5 of us still met up in the Beechtree for a few games. As previously said TUESDAY POOL.
However, that still does not give answers to my for mentioned points of 3 postponements in 1 season, a team playing with no way of contacting them and unsporting conduct over the phone by a commitee member!!!!! |
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| Blockapocket |
Posted on 17-09-2009 19:33
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Home From Home
Posts: 374
Joined: 09.09.09
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The Beechtree was in formed that the game was on ( if you dont pick up your phone you should pick up your messages)
they where told ateam would be there. NO CONFUSION
Put your hands up guys you got it wrong.
DOGGER inrespect of your postponed game the re-arrangements were a result of the waddon sec returning
from hoils on the 5/9/ not your posting |
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| jonesy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 20:02
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Just Popping In
Posts: 9
Joined: 03.09.09
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Since when has a missed call, or so called message been verbal contact. That normally entails actually speaking to someone not a machine!!!! I know that Martin went on holiday and don't expect someone to be think whether a pool game has been arranged properly whilst they are sipping a cold beer on a sunbed. However it doesn't take much effort to pass onto the captain or another responsible person to contact the secretary to ensure that the message has been recieved. You wouldn't email an invoice for ?30k without speaking to the person a couple of days later to ensure they received it would you!!!!!! |
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| Dogger |
Posted on 17-09-2009 20:23
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Must Get Out More
Posts: 805
Joined: 02.10.07
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blockapocket wrote:
The Beechtree was in formed that the game was on ( if you dont pick up your phone you should pick up your messages)
they where told ateam would be there. NO CONFUSION
Put your hands up guys you got it wrong.
DOGGER inrespect of your postponed game the re-arrangements were a result of the waddon sec returning
from hoils on the 5/9/ not your posting
i was unaware of this but if you look at it from our point of view, we made a statement like that, and next day we get phone calls. apologises for not knowing he was on holiday. not the issue of of when he caleld but that fact he called 3 odd time, left a voicemail, and then still rung to speak to our secretary.
Posted by Jonesy
Posted on 03-09-2009 11:16
jonesy wrote:
Correctly so there was a missed call from Martin on Sat 22/8 but no message. Couldn't get hold of him from then on to confirm whether the call was to confirm postponement or the match was to be played. Have received a email from Mark to confirm that no other punishment will be administered to the beechtree in these circumstances. I'm sure the question of so called voicemail messages will be raised at the AGM.
You say on your post that they "should have picked up their messeges". Why, WHY would they lie and say there was no messege, clearly if they had received a messege they would have gone to the match.
"NO CONFUSION", i think someone is definatly confused about what leaving a voicemail actually is. Jonesy your definalty right there, voicemail messeges should of been in question, and should not be a valid way of confirming a fixture. |
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| Blockapocket |
Posted on 17-09-2009 20:24
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Home From Home
Posts: 374
Joined: 09.09.09
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do you think Mark Halsey is responsible enough I understand
he was inreceipt of all the facts before martin went on holiday lets all wait for the meeting and see whats what. |
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| Shaggy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 21:12
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Must Get Out More
Posts: 888
Joined: 02.10.07
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When given the opportunity to still play the game at the AGM, Martin insisted it had to go in front of the committee. Surely he could have said if he so desired that he would agree to it. I am 100% certain than the committee have got better things to do than sit around a table for an hour and if both teams agreed to play it I am pretty certain that the meeting could be cancelled.
Its clear to me taht the Beechtree had no intention not to fulfill the fixture, and only didn't turn up because of communication issues. Given that it is a mix up and not deliberate, and if the Wizards wanted to play the game there is still an opportunity to do so as there is one more week when the game can be played.
So in my opinion there is no need to hide behind a commitee decision. Clearly the Wizards value 10 points more than actually picking up a cue and doing on the table.
And Mark is not in receipt of 'facts'. He is in receipt of two peoples version of events. Unless of course he was there when the Waddon made the phone call, and was also their stalking the Beechtree secretary to see if his voicemail was received and ignored.
Bloody hell Baldrick, its only a game.
Incidentally my mobile phone does not show I have a voicemail message, and its relatively new. These things do happen.
Edited by Shaggy on 17-09-2009 21:14
House!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| longshanks |
Posted on 17-09-2009 21:58
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Must Get Out More
Posts: 709
Joined: 07.10.07
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I don't think that you can consider a message by voicemail, email, text or carrier pigeon to be proper communication unless you have received a response.
I think Shaggy's right - both teams should now agree to play, fix a date and cancel tomorrow's meeting. |
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| jonesy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 22:09
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Just Popping In
Posts: 9
Joined: 03.09.09
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Completely agree all we want to do is play the game, be happy to rearrange for Monday next week if possible. Will only be able to field half a team but would resolve the matter! (Beechtree) |
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| Welshy |
Posted on 17-09-2009 22:44
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Home From Home
Posts: 479
Joined: 02.05.08
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As Jonesy says, we want to play, Monday match would be great, although we might only have 3, thats enough for us to win 6-4 
Edited by Welshy on 17-09-2009 22:46
Fortune Favours the Brave... |
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| longshanks |
Posted on 19-09-2009 16:46
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Must Get Out More
Posts: 709
Joined: 07.10.07
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What happened? |
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